Apocalypse now
Taken from RIUVA. So Odex has finally done it. Singapore’s anime community is doomed. Oh shit. So anyway some poor guy probably wet his pants after receiving this letter.
BTW the organization mentioned in the letter AVPAS (Anti-Piracy Association of Singapore) is similar to the RIAA/RIAS except that Odex appears to be the sole active member. The organization has obtained authorizations from various Japanese studios to represent their rights for all their copyrighted works, even those that are not licensed by Odex for distribution in Singapore. The full list of titles can be found on their website.
Read on for my thoughts.
That said, I am very, very curious as to how Odex, a private entity, managed to obtain personal data from the ISPs based on purely circumstantial evidences. As far as I can see from the AVPAS member list, there is zero indication that it is anything but a private organization. It is related to neither the police nor the relevant government agencies. Therefore, it is the anime equivalent of the RIAA.
However, RIAA, as mighty and powerful as it appears to be, is not able to obtain any personal information from American ISPs directly. It has to do it through the court. That means that it has to first start the legal procedures before the court issues a subpoena that forces the ISP to reveal the identity of the defender and summons the person to court. The defenders in these lawsuits are given the generic name “John Doe” because their names are undisclosed by their ISPs until after the court subpoena. In such cases, the first letter received by the poor sob should be from his own ISP informing him of the existence of such a subpoena for his identity.
The above letter is addressed to the person himself and was sent directly by Odex. This means that Odex, without first going through any legal proceedings, is able to obtain personal information directly from the ISPs using only the IP address. That is insane if you consider the amount of invasive power that has been put into the hands of private company and the potential for abuse by individuals with their personal agendas.
You know, there’s a certain someone whom I really hate on a certain forum. I will fake produce a record of his IP address illegally torrenting a picture that I once drew during a particularly boring physics lecture. I shall then e-mail this “proof” to Singnet and ask for this person’s home address. And if that doesn’t work, I’ll go spend a few bucks to register a company to make the request seem more legitimate…
Of course Odex is a legitimate company that is trying to protect its rights under the current intellectual property rights law (flawed as it may be). But my point is that if a private entity can obtain such information without the prior knowledge of the people involved and without the authority of the court, then what exactly in our legal system is protecting our privacy from abuse by some unscrupulous characters? And if such protection of personal privacy does indeed exist, what exactly allows Odex to bypass it?
Then again, I’m not well-versed with the local legal system. Maybe our privacy laws are really that screwed up. Oh well.
Read this excellent explanation of the “RIAA vs. John Doe” lawsuits, particularly the sections on “How the RIAA identifies the people they sue” and “The Lawsuit Begins”, and compare it to what Odex is apparently authorized to do. Doesn’t RIAA look like the better alternative?
So what are your remaining options for your weekly anime fix?
- Direct download sites
- Obscure Chinese Bittorrent trackers
- XDCC bots on IRC
- Download raws off Winny/Share
- Move to Japan
- Find a job at Odex
Alternatively, find a safer hobby like playing pirated computer games or serial jaywalking.




June 2nd, 2007 at 5:31 pm
lol dun need be so careful… juz kill him.
KILL him.
June 2nd, 2007 at 5:38 pm
bakavic, is it okay for you to dab into the issues on censorship and the release times of odex?
Girls bravo is discontinued after season 1 since they think it’s too much for sg to handle.
I would love to see them release something like chokotto sister and ikkitousen without mda twitching an eyebrow. they have to have the power and guts to put a r21 or m18 on it. afterall most anime fans who are hardcore are about that age.
and the release times of the anime are given the reason that japanese anime dvd have to be released first before odex can do anything. Then it would be wise to advise them to license what they can release.
Cuz what they are doing now is keeping the cake to themselves and letting it rot. how long do you think we will have to wait if they licensed devil may cry now? when it havent even started airing? :/
Overall, i feel that as long as we talk about quality here, they can still counter. since they ARE correct about being the cheapest in the world. though i feel that doesnt give them the excuse to suck. And the article seems to have write in a way as though odex has ALWAYS been releasing dvds. does that guy even goes out? when you walk into a vid shop the anime vcds and all over the place.
June 2nd, 2007 at 6:11 pm
I stand humbled before all you people who know so much about this kind of stuff…
But anyway, thanks DM! For informing me that DDL is safe:) *runs off to her DDL site to continue getting her fix*
June 2nd, 2007 at 6:17 pm
Yeah! “hitoshura” Think that guy doesnt frequent vid shop 95% VCD only 5% DVD and out of the 5%, 3% is mostly OVA or movie not your typical anime tv series.
June 2nd, 2007 at 6:31 pm
@hitoshura: Stuff about censorship is pretty much out of Odex’s hands. The (fogey) censors at MDA are the ones. So Odex can’t really do anything about what gets cut or not.
The idea about N16 and R21 is interesting. If only we could get the people at MDA to realise that anime are not the cartoons of yesteryear. Stuff like “Chokotto Sister” would certainly be too much for them now, seeing that “Elfin Lied” doesn’t even get through.
About the length of time for needed for releases, I’ve made mention about the need to keep customers updated on release info. Letting customers know that a release is coming in X months is infinately better than a permanent “XXX anime will be in stores soon!”. Unfortunately, I’m not sure where to squeeze in your very important point about the long length of time between releases.
About your point concerning price and quality, I too dearly want to shout out loud at Odex that fansubs, which are released quickly, and for free, are a million times better in quality than theirs. Sorry Odex, but you have been beaten in price and quality. If they had at least retained one of those, things would have been drastically different.
Yes, I also agree that the reporter has unfortunately written the article in such a way that protrays that Odex’s catalogue consists only of DVDs, with the word “VCD” never mentioned in the article.
Your points about the Odex’s release time are good. windbell84 has also mentioned something concerning that in his letter. It would be great if you could also write a letter going into further details about these points and others than windbell84, dKiWki, or I have.
@dKiWi: haha, you really do seem out for blood. If my letter doesn’t get through to the forums, I’ll probably join you in mailing the journalist.
June 2nd, 2007 at 6:35 pm
bakavic: some minor quibbles.
[Odex’s current website (www.odex.com.sg) has been showing a In-Construction placeholder...]
should be ‘Under Construction’.
[sparse titles available on DVDs]
should be just DVD, since you’re referring to the format.
[The $9.90 trial offer was also unknown to me.]
The $9.90 trial offer was also unknown to most.
[The quality of releases are debatable. Many fans have commented that subtitle quality were inconsistent between releases, and some tended to be inaccurate, and had constant grammatical errors.]
Moreover, the quality of ODEX’s releases are debatable. Many fans have commented that the quality of their subtitles are inconsistent between releases, tend to be inaccurate, and contain numerous grammatical errors. Surely ODEX, being a commercial entity, should have in place some quality control measures?
[The reason why anime fans perceive that local releases are of low quality, is because that they have benchmarks to compare to.]
Finally, the reason why anime fans here perceive local releases to be of low quality, is because they have benchmarks with which to make comparisons.
[abreast on things.]
should be abreast of.
[There are role models...]
These are role models.
June 2nd, 2007 at 6:48 pm
truth be told we wanna make them feel like we are fighting for the fact that we would get odex stuff and fansubs are free marketing for them.
Cuz right now they prolly think we are just randomly flaming them with excuses for not spending on thier products and being cheap i think.
would love to do so on straits times forum. can anyone gimme a link or something.
honestly, i arent as brave as you guys to post it lol, sadly. I’m already freaked at the fact that the tracking dates back to feb this year.
the only way now is to turn the masses views around and stop seeing us as pirates.
In anycase. someone gimmes the link to straits times forums… I’m lazy to rummage thru the papers..
June 2nd, 2007 at 6:56 pm
Actually Odex doesn’t need us to survive. I have met with the CEO of Odex twice before this incident and from what I gather, Odex doesn’t make any money from VCD and DVD sales at all.
It makes money off providing series for local TV and Animax. The people who watch those channels (i.e. mainstream viewers) do not even know or care about what Odex is doing. Therefore Odex will continue to survive with or without our support, so there’s no use for empty threats here.
You must also realize that Odex is under very heavy constraints placed by the Japanese studios. Singapore is an insignificant market to the Japanese studios, therefore they would rather simply not license anything to us and save the trouble. Therefore the license agreements given to Odex are highly disadvantageous and limited compared to what the American distributors get. The Japanese are more interested in making sure that Odex DVDs don’t become a source for pirated DVDs, therefore they imposed certain limits on the quality allowed and release schedules for R3 releases.
Calm down everyone… I don’t think Odex will be unreasonable and pursue the matter if for example you have a whole stack of R2 DVDs at home. I have read of at least one case where the individual was let off with a warning after contacting AVPAS/Odex.
June 2nd, 2007 at 6:57 pm
If you meant the online discussion board, here it is: http://comment.straitstimes.com/
June 2nd, 2007 at 7:08 pm
then DM, is it safe to say that odex and flip up and go home or go try other business? I mean if the japanese market see us as that insignificant, we can dl all we want lol.
But jokes aside. the first place the japanese market is so cold towards us, is because of bad company performance. They COULD have tried harder to making thier products good and keeping the relationship with thier fans, like chuangyi.
but NOOO… our consumer base is not big enough and going thru this letter thingy might make thigns turn out for the worse… not unless sparrowhawks interview gets spread, there are SOME good light for odex in that interview. so anyone might wanna check it out.
June 2nd, 2007 at 7:25 pm
hey people, i also tried my hand at writing an (incomplete) letter to The Straits Times Forum, but I realised I don’t have a good enough grasp of the issues involved to write a good rebuttal… I’m posting what I have so far in case it might be useful to anyone.
Dear Editor,
I am writing in response to the article “Getting anime illegally online? Beware.” published on June 1, 2007.
According to the article, Mr Sing argued that the view that ODEX’s releases are of poor quality is merely a ‘perception problem’, as focus groups were unable to differentiate fansubs from its DVDs when played back on a 42-inch TV set. However, the real question here is: should ODEX be comparing the video quality of its DVDs with that of fansubs, whose images are recorded off television screens? A better benchmark would have been releases by anime distributors in Japan or the U.S. Moreover, video quality is not the only factor when deciding whether a release is of good quality. Other factors such as the subtitling and the inclusion of DVD extras also come into play, and this is where ODEX fails badly.
ODEX’s subtitles are often inaccurate and contain many grammatical errors, even when compared to fansubs. Surely ODEX, being a commercial entity, should have in place measures to control the quality of their products?
The article also states that prices of DVDs here are much lower compared to the U.S. While this may be true, it should be noted that distributors in the U.S. usually bundle extras and special features into their DVDs – all of which justify the higher price. ODEX’s releases, on the other hand, contain only the anime episodes. In such a situation, it is hardly surprising that prices here are ‘the world’s lowest’.
June 2nd, 2007 at 7:35 pm
what if odex openly admits they used fansubs as a reference for thier subtitling? Would that be a good counter or bad on us?
June 2nd, 2007 at 7:51 pm
Then they’ll be indirectly implying that they’re involved in these kind of illegal activies.
Furthermore, if they said that they do use fansubs for references, they’ll have to excuse to cover their crappy subbing and video quality. It’ll more likely be used against them rather than for them.
I, too, would like to try my hand on writing one of these letters. But I do need help getting start;
- What should i cover?
- Where can i post this lol… No really i don’t get involved with the papers that much.
June 2nd, 2007 at 7:57 pm
Hmmm…..i dun care abt all this crap abt downloading, Odex, AVPAS….if i come cross a gd anime n Odex doesn’t have it, i’ll order from overseas. If Odex have it, i’ll buy from them. So wat’s the big deal abt all this issue?
I guess all this downloading shit thing only affects those pple who juz wanna download animes for free….Now cannot download for free, tt’s y all this hoo-haa started. I’ll rather spend my time checking out on anime news than all these shit…
June 2nd, 2007 at 8:01 pm
That’s a pretty stupid thing to say. Just a heads up.